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sara_tanaquilApparently, I'm on track to do these cases at the rate of one a WEEK instead of one a day. *sob*
Spoiler alert: I have SO MUCH LOVE for the osananajimi storyline of this chapter. Those who haven't played the game (yet), beware! Spoilers lurk within.
PW 1.4
Characters
Eng: Gregory Edgeworth
Jap: 御剣信 (Mitsurugi Shin)
I think he was briefly introduced in an earlier case, but I don't think I included info on his name. His personal name means "belief."
Eng. Manfred von Karma
Jap: 狩魔豪 (Karuma Gou)
The "Manfred von" thing was completely made up for the English translation, as far as I can see. In the Japanese version, the Karma family lived "abroad" in America, not Germany.
The kanji in Karuma's name mean hunter + devil, which is pretty appropriate to his character.
The rest of Court-Record's discussion of the name is so useful, I'm quoting it here:
English: "Karma" being the bad Karma he's built up over the years. May also be based on Manfred von Richthofen, the infamous Red Baron who was brought down by a single bullet (thanks Johan!)
Japanese: "Karuma Gou" can mean several things depending on if you look at pronunciation or kanji meaning.
Pronunciation wise, "Karuma" is the Japanese Romanization for "Karma." "Gou" may come from the word gouka, which could be "the effect of karma" or "fires of hell."
Kanji wise, karu ma means "a demon which hunts," and gou comes from erai, which means "great" or "excellent."
All of them are pretty fitting.
He's so arrogant, he calls himself wagahai (a very supercilious form of "I"). Seriously, who calls themselves that? It took me a while to even figure out what he was saying.
(LOL!! I just answered my own question by googling. The main thing that came up in a google search was the Japanese novel wagahai wa neko de aru, "I am a cat."
Of course a cat would call himself wagahai. From the Amazon review of the novel:
But the problem is that "wagahai" is kind of like the royal "we" taken to extremes; it's a lordly, infinitely superior way of talking, of saying "I". And the "de aru" form is again ultra-formal, just not the way people ever, ever talk. "Neko" is just cat. So the point is that the whole title is insanely incongruous: how could a cat, of all beings, ever say "wagahai", much less use the "de aru" form? Well, this cat can. Believe me, he can. He may have no name, but "wagahai" he is forever, a lord in his domain, a superior being among cats.
The novel sounds like an awesome book, btw.)
Eng: Lotta Hart
Jap: 大騒ぎナツミ (Oosawagi Natsumi)
Oosawagi = uproar, clamor (being loud and obnoxious is supposedly a Kansai trait), with the added implication (I think?) of having something to do with the tabloid press. At least, I'm pretty sure I saw the term used in connection of something being a big sensation in the tabloids.
Lotta Hart speaks with a Kansai (specifically Osaka-ben) dialect. No surprise there – that's pretty much what I suspected from the minute she appeared in the English version, talking in a southern accent.
[Rant]: why do they always make Kansai-ben into southern dialect?? This seems to be a near-universal consensus among English translators, both manga and anime. OK, the Kansai accent does have the connotation of being regional, non-standard, and somewhat looked down upon, which sort of corresponds to the status of the southern accent in mainstream American society. But apart from that, they have nothing in common.
The US perception of the southerner is (forgive me, my southern friends!) laid-back, hospitable, rural, provincial in outlook, uneducated, possibly religious, conservative and/or racist (especially if the character is white). The Kansai, and particularly the Osaka, stereotype is (so far as I can tell) almost NONE of these things, except possibly uneducated (since an educated person might be expected to have unlearned their accent).
The Osaka stereotype, as far as I understand it, is someone who is loud, brash, pushy, hot-tempered, ignores social conventions (notoriously, they can't be bothered to line up for trains like Tokyo folk do, and tend to cross the street against the light), is very business-savvy (not to say penny-pinching), and may just possibly have connections with the mob (yakuza). One of the reasons that the character Osaka from Azumanga Daioh is funny is that her gentle, spacy personality doesn't fit the Osaka stereotype at all. [/rant]
OK, rant aside, I think Lotta's translation is hilarious. Instead of just limiting themselves to turning all of her dialect features into southern drawl (yawn), the translators went to town with the outrageous rural similes. (My personal favorite is actually from the second game. In Japanese, she basically says that the surgeon from the second chapter is well-respected in his profession, but he's not well-liked. In English, she says "... but his personality stinks like wet sheep." Hee!)
The difference between the US southerner stereotype and the Kansai stereotype explains some of the changes they made in the dialogue.
For instance, in English, she says something like "Just 'cause I'm dumb, doesn't mean all southerners are dumb!" In Japanese, she says that not all Kansai folk are けち (but she is). kechi = stingy, fussy about money. This is because she's all worked up about them having wasted a roll of film. One of the Kansai stereotypes is being stingy with money, like New Englanders supposedly are. (Not any of the New Englanders I'VE met, mind you. But traditionally, that's the stereotype.) The same thing comes up later when she offers to trade them information in order to "make it up" to them, rather than giving them information for free: in Japanese, she says "kechi," but in English, she says "unsophisticated."
Another example -- It's not as obvious in the English (because I can read English a whole lot faster than Japanese), but in the beginning, she talks really fast and keeps interrupting them. (The Japanese dialogue panels kept advancing before I was finished reading them.) When Maya comes out of hiding, she says something like "Did I scare you, talking so fast? I can slow it down for you if you like." And after that, she doesn't interrupt. In English, she just says "I kin talk Yank for ya if... ahem... if it pleases you." Kansai people supposedly talk really fast.
Osaka Daigaku = Country U.? Oh, come ON.
Eng: Yanni Yogi
Jap: 灰根 高太郎 (Haine Koutarou)
I haven't got a clue personally about the derivation of his name (Yanni Yogi??), so I'm just quoting from Court-Records:
English: His English name is Yanni Yogi. A few people suggest it comes from "Yami Yugi", referencing the duel-personality character from YuGiOh, but that's not officially stated anywhere.
Japanese: His Japanese name is Koutarou Haine (灰根 高太郎) , a combination of two poets: Takamura Koutarou, who grew ill after losing his beloved wife Chieko, and Haine, a poet who appreciated love and youth.
Eng: Robert Hammond
Jap: 生倉雪夫 (Namakura Yukio)
Even Court-Records has no idea where his name came from.
As for the critters... Missile is really Missile (in katakana). Polly is Sayuri (is that a bird name in Japanese, like Polly is for parrots? Or is it just a girl's name?). I don't know why I found it so amusing that several of the characters kept calling her Sayuri-san. (Awww, Mrs. Whiskers, want some kibble?)
Most WTF Overtranslation
Lotta: "I'd sooner eat the south side of a north-bound skunk than tell you!"
[I so did not need that image in my head.]
Misc Translation Notes
The lake is ひょうたん湖 (Eng. Gourd Lake), so the monster is named ひょっしー (Hyosshii, Eng. "Gourdy"), after "Nessie" of Loch Ness. According to my dictionary, 瓢箪 (hyoutan) means "gourd," while 氷炭 (hyoutan) means "ice and charcoal," and therefore, a contradiction, or something which is inherently contradictory. An intentional pun by the writers, since "Gourdy" doesn't exist?
***
In English, Larry's snack stand sells "Samurai Dogs." In Japanese, he sells – wait for it – とのさまんじゅう (tonosamanjuu -- Tonosama + manjuu). Am I sucker for bad puns? I start laughing every time I look at that. manjuu are pastries stuffed with red bean paste.
***
Maya calls Larry "Yappari-san," too. What is it with people and Larry's name? Did she pick it up from her sister?
***
I don't know why they made Larry's new girlfriend into a Beyonce clone (at least, I assume that's why they call her "Kiyance" and he keeps quoting her as saying "You go girlfriend!" at the end of every sentence). Her name in Japanese is Kazumi. When he quotes her, the only distinctive thing about her speech is that all the sentence-final vowels are drawled (...じゃないかなァ...).
***
In English, Larry calls Edgeworth "Edgey," but in Japanese, he just calls him Mitsurugi, no suffix, because they were childhood friends. (I know leaving off the suffix is significant in Japanese, but do they have to come up with these stupid nicknames to convey that?) Incidentally, he doesn't call him a "stick in the mud" (though the tone of his description is more or less the same) – he says he was a o-bocchan (the son of a wealthy, privileged household). (And for some reason, I find Larry quoting chibi-Edgeworth calling himself "boku" to be painfully cute. ぼくは、コドクなヒトの味方になるのだよ！)
On a sort-of related note... Edgeworth and Phoenix call each other "Mitsurugi" and "Naruhodou," respectively, without suffixes. That's perfectly appropriate for childhood friends (I guess they weren't ever quite close enough to move to first names?). The English translation tries to appromixate that by having them call each other "Edgeworth" and "Wright." That's fine, since it's basically the same as the Japanese, but I get a different feel from reading the Japanese. Having someone as formal and standoffish as Edgeworth call Phoenix "Naruhodou" is just... really touching and intimate, to me. It's one of those things you can't really convey in English at all. I'm profoundly grateful they DIDN'T try to have Edgeworth and Phoenix call each other "Nick" and "Edgey" (shudder).
***
In Japanese, there's a bit of dialogue where Maya is shocked that Edgeworth became a prosecuting attorney, when his father was a famous defense attorney. "But he's a kenji!" Larry is all "Who's Kenji?", and they have to explain what a prosecuting attorney is. In English, when Maya says "prosecuting attorney," he says "What? Edgey's got a proboscis on his knee?" (Truly, translating language-specific puns is hell.)
***
Apparently they have trouble translating the line "He/she is like a god to X," because they do it again when Edgeworth is talking about Karma. He says that Karma, as his mentor who taught him everything about being a prosecuting attorney, is like a god to him (and Phoenix immediately thinks that that's kind of like Mia was to him, which is awfully revealing – Mia is like a goddess to him??). In English, they have Edgeworth say that Karma is a god among prosecutors, which has a different feel. I wonder if there's an unconscious (or conscious) Judeo-Christian bias that makes it difficult for them to translate the phrase literally? Or am I putting too much weight on the literal meaning of the Japanese?
***
It's a small point, I guess, but at the end of Lotta's testimony, when Edgeworth asks Phoenix to carry a message to Maya, and then all he says (instead of "Thank you") is "Tell her to watch what she says in court" – what Phoenix thinks in Japanese is "He's not being sunao." I would have translated that as something like "Why can't he just say what he really means?" In the English translation, Phoenix thinks "Yeah, I'm sure she'll be happy to hear you say that, Edgeworth. Jerk!" That seems way too harsh, in context. I've seen people commenting on LJ that Phoenix is often harsher, more sarcastic and more aggressive in English than Naruhodou is in Japanese.
***
Hmm, so, around this point in the game, I got so absorbed in it, I played through the rest of the game in Japanese without stopping to review the English at all. I did eventually finish playing through in English, but by that time I couldn't always remember exactly what they said in Japanese, so it was harder to compare. I did make a note of the things I was curious about, though.
***
Karma's objections to Phoenix's attempt to prove that the number of the safe and/or the name of the pet parrot are significant to the case are hilarious.
For the number of the safe: in English, he says that his ATM card number is 0001, "because I'm number one!" It's a great line (and fits his personality perfectly), but that's not what he says in Japanese. In Japanese, his ATM card number is 4649, "because it spells yoroshiku." (Now contemplating using that one the next time I have to come up with some inane online password.)
For the thing about pet names, the translation of his objection is pretty close. He says that his granddaughter has a dog named Ryuu, so does that make Phoenix (first name in Japanese = Ryuuichi) her fiance? "She's only seven years old!"
***
Argh, OK, if there were other translation differences, I can't remember them now. All other reflections are subsumed by the complete and utter cuteness of Edgeworth trying to imitate Gumshoe's method of celebrating, because Maya tells him to. "Woooooot! *slinks off*" I could replay the end credits, like, ten times just to read that line over and over again.
I'm not even sure when I'll get the next one done, because... arrgh. Those of you who have played, remember how annoying the lunch lady and the patrolman who thinks he's a cowboy are? (Well, they annoyed the living heck out of me, anyway.) In Japanese, they're a million times worse. I can't understand a word they're saying, and when I play through the same segment in English to try to figure it out, it's apparent to me from the little I do understand that the English translation is totally changing whatever it was they originally said. *sigh* I'm afraid I'm going to have to play through the whole game with dictionary in hand just to figure out what's going on. Stay tuned.
Spoiler alert: I have SO MUCH LOVE for the osananajimi storyline of this chapter. Those who haven't played the game (yet), beware! Spoilers lurk within.
PW 1.4
Characters
Eng: Gregory Edgeworth
Jap: 御剣信 (Mitsurugi Shin)
I think he was briefly introduced in an earlier case, but I don't think I included info on his name. His personal name means "belief."
Eng. Manfred von Karma
Jap: 狩魔豪 (Karuma Gou)
The "Manfred von" thing was completely made up for the English translation, as far as I can see. In the Japanese version, the Karma family lived "abroad" in America, not Germany.
The kanji in Karuma's name mean hunter + devil, which is pretty appropriate to his character.
The rest of Court-Record's discussion of the name is so useful, I'm quoting it here:
English: "Karma" being the bad Karma he's built up over the years. May also be based on Manfred von Richthofen, the infamous Red Baron who was brought down by a single bullet (thanks Johan!)
Japanese: "Karuma Gou" can mean several things depending on if you look at pronunciation or kanji meaning.
Pronunciation wise, "Karuma" is the Japanese Romanization for "Karma." "Gou" may come from the word gouka, which could be "the effect of karma" or "fires of hell."
Kanji wise, karu ma means "a demon which hunts," and gou comes from erai, which means "great" or "excellent."
All of them are pretty fitting.
He's so arrogant, he calls himself wagahai (a very supercilious form of "I"). Seriously, who calls themselves that? It took me a while to even figure out what he was saying.
(LOL!! I just answered my own question by googling. The main thing that came up in a google search was the Japanese novel wagahai wa neko de aru, "I am a cat."
Of course a cat would call himself wagahai. From the Amazon review of the novel:
But the problem is that "wagahai" is kind of like the royal "we" taken to extremes; it's a lordly, infinitely superior way of talking, of saying "I". And the "de aru" form is again ultra-formal, just not the way people ever, ever talk. "Neko" is just cat. So the point is that the whole title is insanely incongruous: how could a cat, of all beings, ever say "wagahai", much less use the "de aru" form? Well, this cat can. Believe me, he can. He may have no name, but "wagahai" he is forever, a lord in his domain, a superior being among cats.
The novel sounds like an awesome book, btw.)
Eng: Lotta Hart
Jap: 大騒ぎナツミ (Oosawagi Natsumi)
Oosawagi = uproar, clamor (being loud and obnoxious is supposedly a Kansai trait), with the added implication (I think?) of having something to do with the tabloid press. At least, I'm pretty sure I saw the term used in connection of something being a big sensation in the tabloids.
Lotta Hart speaks with a Kansai (specifically Osaka-ben) dialect. No surprise there – that's pretty much what I suspected from the minute she appeared in the English version, talking in a southern accent.
[Rant]: why do they always make Kansai-ben into southern dialect?? This seems to be a near-universal consensus among English translators, both manga and anime. OK, the Kansai accent does have the connotation of being regional, non-standard, and somewhat looked down upon, which sort of corresponds to the status of the southern accent in mainstream American society. But apart from that, they have nothing in common.
The US perception of the southerner is (forgive me, my southern friends!) laid-back, hospitable, rural, provincial in outlook, uneducated, possibly religious, conservative and/or racist (especially if the character is white). The Kansai, and particularly the Osaka, stereotype is (so far as I can tell) almost NONE of these things, except possibly uneducated (since an educated person might be expected to have unlearned their accent).
The Osaka stereotype, as far as I understand it, is someone who is loud, brash, pushy, hot-tempered, ignores social conventions (notoriously, they can't be bothered to line up for trains like Tokyo folk do, and tend to cross the street against the light), is very business-savvy (not to say penny-pinching), and may just possibly have connections with the mob (yakuza). One of the reasons that the character Osaka from Azumanga Daioh is funny is that her gentle, spacy personality doesn't fit the Osaka stereotype at all. [/rant]
OK, rant aside, I think Lotta's translation is hilarious. Instead of just limiting themselves to turning all of her dialect features into southern drawl (yawn), the translators went to town with the outrageous rural similes. (My personal favorite is actually from the second game. In Japanese, she basically says that the surgeon from the second chapter is well-respected in his profession, but he's not well-liked. In English, she says "... but his personality stinks like wet sheep." Hee!)
The difference between the US southerner stereotype and the Kansai stereotype explains some of the changes they made in the dialogue.
For instance, in English, she says something like "Just 'cause I'm dumb, doesn't mean all southerners are dumb!" In Japanese, she says that not all Kansai folk are けち (but she is). kechi = stingy, fussy about money. This is because she's all worked up about them having wasted a roll of film. One of the Kansai stereotypes is being stingy with money, like New Englanders supposedly are. (Not any of the New Englanders I'VE met, mind you. But traditionally, that's the stereotype.) The same thing comes up later when she offers to trade them information in order to "make it up" to them, rather than giving them information for free: in Japanese, she says "kechi," but in English, she says "unsophisticated."
Another example -- It's not as obvious in the English (because I can read English a whole lot faster than Japanese), but in the beginning, she talks really fast and keeps interrupting them. (The Japanese dialogue panels kept advancing before I was finished reading them.) When Maya comes out of hiding, she says something like "Did I scare you, talking so fast? I can slow it down for you if you like." And after that, she doesn't interrupt. In English, she just says "I kin talk Yank for ya if... ahem... if it pleases you." Kansai people supposedly talk really fast.
Osaka Daigaku = Country U.? Oh, come ON.
Eng: Yanni Yogi
Jap: 灰根 高太郎 (Haine Koutarou)
I haven't got a clue personally about the derivation of his name (Yanni Yogi??), so I'm just quoting from Court-Records:
English: His English name is Yanni Yogi. A few people suggest it comes from "Yami Yugi", referencing the duel-personality character from YuGiOh, but that's not officially stated anywhere.
Japanese: His Japanese name is Koutarou Haine (灰根 高太郎) , a combination of two poets: Takamura Koutarou, who grew ill after losing his beloved wife Chieko, and Haine, a poet who appreciated love and youth.
Eng: Robert Hammond
Jap: 生倉雪夫 (Namakura Yukio)
Even Court-Records has no idea where his name came from.
As for the critters... Missile is really Missile (in katakana). Polly is Sayuri (is that a bird name in Japanese, like Polly is for parrots? Or is it just a girl's name?). I don't know why I found it so amusing that several of the characters kept calling her Sayuri-san. (Awww, Mrs. Whiskers, want some kibble?)
Most WTF Overtranslation
Lotta: "I'd sooner eat the south side of a north-bound skunk than tell you!"
[I so did not need that image in my head.]
Misc Translation Notes
The lake is ひょうたん湖 (Eng. Gourd Lake), so the monster is named ひょっしー (Hyosshii, Eng. "Gourdy"), after "Nessie" of Loch Ness. According to my dictionary, 瓢箪 (hyoutan) means "gourd," while 氷炭 (hyoutan) means "ice and charcoal," and therefore, a contradiction, or something which is inherently contradictory. An intentional pun by the writers, since "Gourdy" doesn't exist?
***
In English, Larry's snack stand sells "Samurai Dogs." In Japanese, he sells – wait for it – とのさまんじゅう (tonosamanjuu -- Tonosama + manjuu). Am I sucker for bad puns? I start laughing every time I look at that. manjuu are pastries stuffed with red bean paste.
***
Maya calls Larry "Yappari-san," too. What is it with people and Larry's name? Did she pick it up from her sister?
***
I don't know why they made Larry's new girlfriend into a Beyonce clone (at least, I assume that's why they call her "Kiyance" and he keeps quoting her as saying "You go girlfriend!" at the end of every sentence). Her name in Japanese is Kazumi. When he quotes her, the only distinctive thing about her speech is that all the sentence-final vowels are drawled (...じゃないかなァ...).
***
In English, Larry calls Edgeworth "Edgey," but in Japanese, he just calls him Mitsurugi, no suffix, because they were childhood friends. (I know leaving off the suffix is significant in Japanese, but do they have to come up with these stupid nicknames to convey that?) Incidentally, he doesn't call him a "stick in the mud" (though the tone of his description is more or less the same) – he says he was a o-bocchan (the son of a wealthy, privileged household). (And for some reason, I find Larry quoting chibi-Edgeworth calling himself "boku" to be painfully cute. ぼくは、コドクなヒトの味方になるのだよ！)
On a sort-of related note... Edgeworth and Phoenix call each other "Mitsurugi" and "Naruhodou," respectively, without suffixes. That's perfectly appropriate for childhood friends (I guess they weren't ever quite close enough to move to first names?). The English translation tries to appromixate that by having them call each other "Edgeworth" and "Wright." That's fine, since it's basically the same as the Japanese, but I get a different feel from reading the Japanese. Having someone as formal and standoffish as Edgeworth call Phoenix "Naruhodou" is just... really touching and intimate, to me. It's one of those things you can't really convey in English at all. I'm profoundly grateful they DIDN'T try to have Edgeworth and Phoenix call each other "Nick" and "Edgey" (shudder).
***
In Japanese, there's a bit of dialogue where Maya is shocked that Edgeworth became a prosecuting attorney, when his father was a famous defense attorney. "But he's a kenji!" Larry is all "Who's Kenji?", and they have to explain what a prosecuting attorney is. In English, when Maya says "prosecuting attorney," he says "What? Edgey's got a proboscis on his knee?" (Truly, translating language-specific puns is hell.)
***
Apparently they have trouble translating the line "He/she is like a god to X," because they do it again when Edgeworth is talking about Karma. He says that Karma, as his mentor who taught him everything about being a prosecuting attorney, is like a god to him (and Phoenix immediately thinks that that's kind of like Mia was to him, which is awfully revealing – Mia is like a goddess to him??). In English, they have Edgeworth say that Karma is a god among prosecutors, which has a different feel. I wonder if there's an unconscious (or conscious) Judeo-Christian bias that makes it difficult for them to translate the phrase literally? Or am I putting too much weight on the literal meaning of the Japanese?
***
It's a small point, I guess, but at the end of Lotta's testimony, when Edgeworth asks Phoenix to carry a message to Maya, and then all he says (instead of "Thank you") is "Tell her to watch what she says in court" – what Phoenix thinks in Japanese is "He's not being sunao." I would have translated that as something like "Why can't he just say what he really means?" In the English translation, Phoenix thinks "Yeah, I'm sure she'll be happy to hear you say that, Edgeworth. Jerk!" That seems way too harsh, in context. I've seen people commenting on LJ that Phoenix is often harsher, more sarcastic and more aggressive in English than Naruhodou is in Japanese.
***
Hmm, so, around this point in the game, I got so absorbed in it, I played through the rest of the game in Japanese without stopping to review the English at all. I did eventually finish playing through in English, but by that time I couldn't always remember exactly what they said in Japanese, so it was harder to compare. I did make a note of the things I was curious about, though.
***
Karma's objections to Phoenix's attempt to prove that the number of the safe and/or the name of the pet parrot are significant to the case are hilarious.
For the number of the safe: in English, he says that his ATM card number is 0001, "because I'm number one!" It's a great line (and fits his personality perfectly), but that's not what he says in Japanese. In Japanese, his ATM card number is 4649, "because it spells yoroshiku." (Now contemplating using that one the next time I have to come up with some inane online password.)
For the thing about pet names, the translation of his objection is pretty close. He says that his granddaughter has a dog named Ryuu, so does that make Phoenix (first name in Japanese = Ryuuichi) her fiance? "She's only seven years old!"
***
Argh, OK, if there were other translation differences, I can't remember them now. All other reflections are subsumed by the complete and utter cuteness of Edgeworth trying to imitate Gumshoe's method of celebrating, because Maya tells him to. "Woooooot! *slinks off*" I could replay the end credits, like, ten times just to read that line over and over again.
I'm not even sure when I'll get the next one done, because... arrgh. Those of you who have played, remember how annoying the lunch lady and the patrolman who thinks he's a cowboy are? (Well, they annoyed the living heck out of me, anyway.) In Japanese, they're a million times worse. I can't understand a word they're saying, and when I play through the same segment in English to try to figure it out, it's apparent to me from the little I do understand that the English translation is totally changing whatever it was they originally said. *sigh* I'm afraid I'm going to have to play through the whole game with dictionary in hand just to figure out what's going on. Stay tuned.
