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sara_tanaquilNot a big surprise after yesterday...
I will never forget the horrified look I got from one of my more intellectual anime-loving colleagues to whom I tried to show this. (And this, should I say, from a colleague who could appreciate the exquisite irony of the Marmalade Boy/Level C mashup I inadvertently exposed her to.)
Yeah, the barbie-doll aesthetics of the naked girl transformation scenes are appalling, the monster of the week plots are repetitive, the makers of the dub should be shot. (And that's not even taking into account Sailor Says. Sailor Says!) But behind all that, there is some surprisingly epic backstory, great moments of drama (if few and far between), and some not-too-shabby character development. And, well, back in the days of 1994 when it was on Fox Kids or whatever it was right after Bananas in Pajamas, it was all I had. (It's too bad I didn't know there were such a thing as fansubs until much, much, later, since I probably would have appreciated it even more if I could have made the transition from dubs sooner. As it is, I have never yet met Sailors Uranus and Neptune.)
I will never forget the horrified look I got from one of my more intellectual anime-loving colleagues to whom I tried to show this. (And this, should I say, from a colleague who could appreciate the exquisite irony of the Marmalade Boy/Level C mashup I inadvertently exposed her to.)
Yeah, the barbie-doll aesthetics of the naked girl transformation scenes are appalling, the monster of the week plots are repetitive, the makers of the dub should be shot. (And that's not even taking into account Sailor Says. Sailor Says!) But behind all that, there is some surprisingly epic backstory, great moments of drama (if few and far between), and some not-too-shabby character development. And, well, back in the days of 1994 when it was on Fox Kids or whatever it was right after Bananas in Pajamas, it was all I had. (It's too bad I didn't know there were such a thing as fansubs until much, much, later, since I probably would have appreciated it even more if I could have made the transition from dubs sooner. As it is, I have never yet met Sailors Uranus and Neptune.)
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no subject
Date: 2011-05-11 11:08 pm (UTC)Interestingly enough, the Uranus/Neptune episodes are the only ones that I've watched. (Ogata Megumi yay!)
If I had to name something, I'd probably pick Level C. I can't really think of anything else corny enough to qualify.
no subject
Date: 2011-05-12 01:41 pm (UTC)Thank you for reminding me that I'm rather embarrassed to admit I own the Papa to Kiss in the Dark DVDs (the expensive Japanese ones, even). I'm not sure "enjoy" is the correct word for my feelings about it, but I guess that's the closest for the purpose of this meme.
no subject
Date: 2011-05-12 03:56 pm (UTC)I actually think, if I had to pick something, it would be I! My! Me! Strawberry Eggs. I liked it enough that I bought it, er, twice.. (DON'T JUDGE ME), but a few years ago I sold it off because I felt like my sensibilities had way changed and I was pretty sure I'd never watch it again. But having watched it 2 1/2 times, and even showing it to other friends, I definitely can't say I hated it at the time. (Though I also couldn't really explain why I liked it, either...)
no subject
Date: 2011-05-12 12:44 am (UTC)On the other hand, the anime I am ashamed of owning, I wouldn't actually say I objectively enjoyed. Fujimi, the first two Kizunas...I'm not ashamed of them because they're yaoi, but because they're chopped up and incoherent.
no subject
Date: 2011-05-12 01:36 am (UTC)Un-twin D:
Date: 2011-05-12 04:09 am (UTC)Why?? I must know what you feel makes these something you couldn't mention to a non-fan? I haven't seen a single episode of Bleach, mind you, but I read a lot of the manga before I died somewhere, so I think I can still include it.
Heck, in thinking about this meme the other day actually, I had tremendous angst in deciding if KKM was my favorite anime of all time. (It didn't win, but I have ANGST about the decision. :P) And HnG? One of the few anime I've cosplayed from (TWICE!) and I desperately wish someone - anyone - other than Viz-of-the-cancellations had licensed the anime because all I ever wanted to do was buy it to watch over and over and over forever (and I've already watched it 3 times, so that should tell you something).
Seriously, I weep for this statement!
Re: Un-twin D:
Date: 2011-05-12 02:51 pm (UTC)Well, the key here is non-fan. I don't pimp outside people's known genre preferences. It's why I don't try to get my f'list to play Sims (except you, W_10_00. You're dead to me! You know why) or watch Generator Rex. (*sigh* If only I could count Generator Rex as my mecha anime, 'cause I don't think I like ANY mecha.)
The series I listed have heavy genre appeal (moe characters, repetitious fighting) and don't really "rise above" their genres. Even series that do rise above -- Trigun, Cowboy Bebop -- don't break through the genre ceiling. They just avoid the excessive padding typical of genre shows to keep a more coherent storyline.
Totoro, on the other hand, is just good viewing. If you can't enjoy Totoro, you don't enjoy having eyes or ever having been a child. And Kino no Tabi is thought-provoking with minimal fan service.
Re: Un-twin D:
Date: 2011-05-12 03:18 pm (UTC)Well, I can see why you might not want to do *that* but it just seemed like you were framing it with self-preservation. Like you were ashamed to talk about them? I just don't think people should be ashamed of the genres they like. I understand the lofty goals of transcending the genre, but at the same time, people don't generally scoff at universal story traits like having endearing characters or engaging action sequences. I can talk about a series reasonably abstractly with someone who is not a fan of it by describing what I like about it ... just like I would do with a book or a tv show or a movie or piece of music... but maybe I'm misunderstanding you and what you are referring to is more the pimping aspects and not just discussion?
I have historically found that non-fans are going to remain non-fans no matter what I show them. Despite the fact that I have extremely high success rates in recommending things to existing fans, I haven't ever successfully converted any non-fans (that I know of)... Even the one person I had some success with sort of did it on his own and then grew out of it a year later. (He's always been pretty ADD with his interests, though.) :/
Incidentally: I am always - always - looking for new things to experience. I take genre/style into account, because of course I do have my tastes, but if someone thinks something is worthwhile I will usually give it a shot. (Also, my preferences, for just about everything, range far and wide!)
Re: Un-twin D:
Date: 2011-05-12 04:11 pm (UTC)I like -- or liked -- romance novels. I object when people dismiss the genre as "cheesy" and "trashy," because those are terms they would never apply to any other genre, when all genres suffer from the same weaknesses of repetition and cliche and fan service. But I still see those weaknesses and can lovingly mock them myself. It's an insider/outsider division.
Clear as mud?
Re: Un-twin D:
Date: 2011-05-12 04:39 pm (UTC)Re: Un-twin D:
Date: 2011-05-12 03:54 pm (UTC)This is where I think your interpretation of the topic is different from mine. I interpret "ashamed" in this prompt as "this series doesn't live up to my normal standards, so I shouldn't like it, but somehow I like it anyway." It is only relevant to my own personal tastes, not some other person's, fan or not.
P.S.
Why didn't I make myself an "it's all about me" icon...?
Re: Un-twin D:
Date: 2011-05-12 04:04 pm (UTC)I win at all about me.
Sailor Moon is anime's mom
Date: 2011-05-12 12:50 am (UTC)Without Sailor Moon, there would've been no Evangelion, and without Evangelion, anime would still just be "kids stuff" with the infrequent "Akira" or "ghost in the shell" now and then in a theatre.
no subject
Date: 2011-05-12 04:25 am (UTC)I think this might have been the same face I gave my friend when he returned from a year abroad in Thailand raving about this show (which was shortly before it showed up on US TV, I believe). I'd been all behind the whole G-Force and Bubblegum Crisis sides of anime, but even my gay boyfriend couldn't sell me on sparkly sailor scouts.
... Until one day in college when my non-anime fan roommate was watching a borrowed tape from our neighbor and suddenly I WAS sold and it was all over from there. (Incidentally, it would be those scenes in S1 that rate highly on both cheese and sadness [aka drama] factors in the dub that made me realize I had to stop mocking Sailormoon and start loving it.)
I actually have great nostalgic hilarity-love for the dub (in the same way I have it for Yu-gi-oh), even though I own and tout the vast superiority of the JP versions. I am probably more ashamed to admit that I honestly do wish I had bought the dub dvds for posterity's sake than I am to admit I like Sailormoon.
no subject
Date: 2011-05-12 01:26 pm (UTC)I still have my old VHS tapes that I recorded off TV. >.> I agree with you on the superiority of the Japanese version ("Who's Darien? I'm PRINCE Darien!"), but I really loved the dub when I first saw it and I still have a lot of nostalgia for it.
no subject
Date: 2011-05-12 02:32 pm (UTC)Hah, me too! I also have the commercial VHS (boxset!) release of the Doom Tree arc as well as some random singles, but those tapes won't be around forever, and I have a feeling re-watching the taped off tv episodes would frustrate me after awhile since a lot are out of order or were are cut off at the endings and such (yay VHS timers....). Ha: I remember the episode where Neflite died*, it cut off right at the critical point - I was so mad at the time.
*should I have spoiler tagged that? ;)
no subject
Date: 2011-05-12 03:44 pm (UTC)Haha, oh my, I was so OCD about preserving episode order and getting exactly the right time. If I missed an episode, I probably would have waited for the reruns to cycle around again. (Though I don't remember whether that ever happened or not.) And I always set the timer for too long and then rewound the tape so the next episode would start right after the end credits. I was pretty, uh, fanatical about the whole thing.
(With my Darkwing Duck tapes, I often recorded live and edited the commercials right out, but since Sailor Moon aired at 4:30am, I pretty much had to rely on the timer.)
no subject
Date: 2011-05-12 04:13 pm (UTC)Please accept these chicks in lieu of a "you are adorable" sticker.
Still twins!
Date: 2011-05-12 04:17 pm (UTC)(OMG, now I seriously don't know why I didn't buy the YGO discs in thoese cheap sets... argh....want to re-watch so bad now...and my tapes are crap!)
Re: Still twins!
Date: 2011-05-13 02:07 am (UTC)I think I defined "embarrassed" in terms of being embarrassed to share it even with a fellow fan who (mostly) shares my taste, but yeah. The kind of conversation that always ends with you saying "But... it's GOOD! Really!"
LOL forever at the OCD VCR behavior. Been there, taped that.
no subject
Date: 2011-05-12 04:20 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-05-13 02:09 am (UTC)